2025-08-29: Personal and Impersonal
- Log: 2025-08-29 Personal and Impersonal
- Cast: Ren Amamiya, Goro Akechi, Kasumi Yoshizawa
- Where: Kichijoji, Tokyo
- OOC Date: August 30, 2025
- IC Date: July 03, 2012
- Summary: After a chance ("chance") encounter in Shibuya, Ren, Kasumi, and Akechi go to a cafe in Kichijoji to pre-celebrate Kasumi's victory in an upcoming gymnastics meet, then get into an increasingly intense discussion on the Phantom Thieves.
<Pose Tracker> Ren Amamiya has posed.
It's a lovely July afternoon this Tuesday. Kaneshiro's change of heart is official, and now that that's done, Ren can take his time on a number of things now. That's how he was when Kasumi caught up with him at Shibuya Station on the way home and told him she had some exciting news to share--just in time for Akechi, of all people, to walk up and join the conversation.
After yesterday, it should probably be awkward. Ren finds it's not.
How exactly all of that goes is up to each individual, of course, but Ren looks back at Kasumi. "By the way--that competition you mentioned before, when's it happening? It's been about two weeks since you mentioned it." And she said that it'd be in another couple of weeks. He smiles at her. "I hope I didn't miss it."
They look over at Akechi. He and Kasumi seem acquainted with each other, as far as they can tell, but how exactly is still a mystery... until one of them explains it, anyway.
<Pose Tracker> Goro Akechi has posed.
You know, it's strange how stake outs like this work out. In this case, he was following around Ren from a distance... just, trying to get a feel for his day to day.
It's definitely not being some sort of stalker. No, this was in fact his job. Working as a Detective on the Phantom Thieves case...
... but when Yoshizawa-san approaches him, all smiles and sunshine... he finds himself feeling something strange deep within. Watching her smile, watching Ren respond.
He'd heard rumors of her 'involvement' with a delinquent, even spoke to her on the matter. And seeing the back and forth of pleasantries...
... he finds his plan of 'following' Ren around just changing, in real time, as he approaches the two. "Huh? Amamiya-kun? I didn't expect to cross paths with you today... And the same for you, Yoshizawa-san. It's so good to see you again."
That was how it started, at least. Now though? Ren brings up her competition, and Akechi responds, "Ah yes, last I saw you, you were hard at work practicing. I hated to impose on you, but it was for the sake of my investigation."
He says as he shifted stances, looking towards Ren, "Oh, perhaps you're wondering how we met? I'm acquainted with her from my TV appearances."
He leaves the rest up to Kasumi to explain.
<Pose Tracker> Kasumi Yoshizawa has posed.
Kasumi steps off the train in her usual Shujin uniform, her bag slung over her shoulder. As she starts to walk through the station, she notices the familiar Ren a little futher ahead. There he is! Kasumi quickly picks up the pace a little, raising her hand to wave at him as she smiles, "Amamiya-senpai!"
The two exchange greetings and chat briefly as they walk through the station. The usual pleasantries and stuff. They are just about to start talking on more significant matters when another joins their small group. Kasumi looks a little surprised, both to suddenly see Akechi here (this one is a pleasant surprise of course) and also that he apparently already knows Ren.
Kasumi smiles, "Akechi-san! It's a pleasure to see you too! Quite the coincidence, running into each other here. Are you working on a case at the moment?" She's just asking out of politeness and interest, having no idea that that's actually what he's doing.
The topic of her upcoming gymnastics meet is brought off and Kasumi brightens even more, "That's quite alright, Akechi-san. I don't think I was able to give you much information, but I hope it was helpful in your investigation!" Meanwhile, to Ren she says, "The meet is actually this Thursday afternoon after school! I'd be very happy if you can make it. Oh, but only if you don't have anything else important at the time. I'll send you the details!" She reaches into her bag and pulls out her phone. But after tapping the screen a few times and even shaking it, she frowns slightly, "Oh dear, it seems my phone is acting up again..." A quick glance from the two and they'll be able to figure out why that might be. Given the large crack across the screen, it must be damaged somewhat.
Still, Kasumi doesn't let it keep her down for long as she smiles again, "I'll make sure to send it to you when I get home."
When Akechi mentions how the two of them know each other, Kasumi nods enthusiastically, "My father is a director of one of the talkshows at Sakura TV! I sometimes go and watch the filming and Akechi-san has been interviewed on it a few times. So we run into each other there occasionally."
Kasumi looks between the two boys, "Though I didn't know that you two knew each other so well!" Or at least that's the impression she got from their brief interaction so far.
<Pose Tracker> Ren Amamiya has posed.
Credit where credit's due: Akechi is much better at stalking (oops, we mean tailing suspects) than Makoto is. Ren doesn't always spot him, even with Morgana on his back, and he didn't spot him today before he walked up to join them and Kasumi, either. It does feel like a stretch to call it a coincidence, seeing him two days in a row, but Ren will let it slide.
He did certainly look happy to see Kasumi, turning to face her with a welcoming smile when she called his name and ran up to him. They shared their pleasantries, and they really are pleasant.
Ren's look turns inquisitive when Akechi explains the nature of their acquaintance without actually explaining anything about it. It goes from inquisitive to flat when it becomes apparent Akechi came to Shujin Academy and questioned Kasumi. There's one reason he'd do that.
Well, Kasumi being here means it's easy to ignore. He genuinely is interested in what she has to say, anyway, a smile returning. "This Thursday? Good, I just made it." Too bad Kasumi's phone is broken... Really significantly broken. Ren refrains from asking why she doesn't get a replacement. She must have a good reason.
"Just tell me the details and I'll type them down," he suggests, holding up his phone. But... So Kasumi's dad is in show business. "That makes sense," he muses. Hard to think of that as anything but a coincidence, either. Ren glances at Akechi. Maybe those can happen with him every once in a while.
Kasumi remarks on their own acquaintance with Akechi. "We hang out sometimes," Ren replies, and leaves it at that.
...
He's definitely paying more attention to Kasumi...
<Pose Tracker> Goro Akechi has posed.
"I was just on my way back from a consultation, so my afternoon is shockingly free at the moment."
Akechi's faux affable smile surely shines as Kasumi indicates she wasn't able to give him much information, "Oh - don't sell yourself short. Our talk helped me get my thoughts in order for the task at hand." Akechi watches the act of her sending him the details, or at least - trying to, and in his eyes it rather confirms his suspicions.
Ren not only indicating he doesn't want to miss it, but Kasumi enthusiastically sending him the details. Yes, social rules dictate that the proper thing to do in this situation is for him to politely see himself off, as he's what is known as a 'Third Wheel.'
... Except, Goro Akechi refuses to think of himself as playing second fiddle when it comes to his rival-to-be.
He allows Kasumi to explain, and nods in confirmation, "Yes, precisely. And well, she was always such a breath of fresh air to chat with that I couldn't help but take the time to network with her. She's always so knowledgeable about the business..." Ren is definitely staring at her though...
Like he's not a concern at all. Unacceptable.
There's an easy enough way to turn that on it's head though as he turns to Kasumi, "Oh, now I see. So this is what the rumors were about. Aha- had I known it was Amamiya-kun, I would have discounted them right away." He chuckles softly at Kasumi, as if he were sharing an inside joke. After all, he came to her and mentioned 'a rough crowd' she'd been hanging with, but named no names, nor did Kasumi.
He acts like it was no concern whatsoever, but now it's a rumor about Ren that the two of them had talked about and caused some kind of misunderstanding!
"I looked up your team after I saw you that day, Yoshizawa-san. As I recall, it's quite prestigious? And you're their representative in the upcoming tournament... I must say, it's extremely impressive." He says with a smile, "I'll definitely be cheering you on as well. Ah, say, I have an idea - since all three of us are here, why don't we go somewhere as a group? We can call it our little celebration of your coming victory."
Such a warm smile, "And while we're there, perhaps I could ask you for some advice on an upcoming advertising campaign? I'm interested in your perspective on how it would appeal to the youth demographic."
Akechi, Akechi are you NOT the youth!? Akechi please.
But it is asking for Kasumi's expert opinion on a subject she's knowledgeable about, as he does his damndest to keep her distracted so that Ren can't focus on just her, or she on him.
His hope is that him becoming the center of attention rather forces the issue with Ren.
<Pose Tracker> Kasumi Yoshizawa has posed.
"Oh, alright then!" Kasumi provides the details for Ren to take down. Thankfully the competition is happening locally, a relatively short hop on a train from Shujin. After she is finished, she turns to Akechi, "I don't know if you're interested in such things, but you're welcome to come watch too, Akechi-san! The three of us could hang out afterwards." Since he and Ren appear to be friends, Kasumi thinks it'd be a fun opportunity!
Though... Now that she thinks about it... It's a bit odd that they are friends. Didn't Akechi make indirect references to Ren's criminal past? Though she doesn't recall Akechi mentioning his name specifically... Oh well, it's probably nothing.
As Akechi praises her for her knowledge, Kasumi laughs in mild embarrassment, "I wouldn't say I'm especially knowledgeable. But I do like to help my father out when I can. And everyone on the cast and crew are so nice, it's fun to do so."
Ah! It turns out that their previous discussion maybe involved a misunderstanding, "Oh! I see. Well, it's good that things have been cleared up then. I know some of the rumors about Amamiya-senpai aren't especially nice... So I thought that's what you were talking about." Kasumi looks at Ren, raising and shaking her hands quickly to ward off another misunderstanding, "Of course the rumours are clearly exaggerated and I don't believe them."
When Akechi brings up her position within the gymnastics club, there is a very, very brief moment of uncertainty in Kasumi's expression. But it is quickly covered by her usual smile, "Yes, everyone in the club works very hard to do there best. I'm not sure I really deserve all the attention and focus I get. One of my senpais who is a second year is actually very... Enthusiastic about the club..." She trails off a bit as she glances away for a moment. Apparently not everything is super happy in the rhythmic gymnastics club.
But Akechi suggests they head somewhere, asking for some help. Kasumi latches onto that, happy for a change of subject, "Oh, yes! I'd be happy to offer any advice I can. And I'm sure Amamiya-senpai might have some thought as well, yes?" She turns to Ren and smiles, "After all, you've helped me out quite a bit already."
<Pose Tracker> Ren Amamiya has posed.
When Akechi says--or at least implies--that he likes Kasumi as a friend and enjoys her company, Ren relaxes a bit. Maybe he did come question her about things involving Ren, but it sounds like (emphasis on sounds like) they do have their own relationship outside of that. Akechi's even nice to her, unlike, for example, that police lady from the Yongen koban. That's good--all of it.
"Your consultations sure take you to Shibuya a lot," Ren does comment, though. Just to tweak Akechi's nose a bit. It's (mostly) good-natured.
...Maybe that's why Akechi laughs about some rumors about Kasumi that have turned out to be about him--to tweak his nose back. Ren looks between the two of them, and it's Kasumi who talks about the rumors about him that 'aren't nice.' "Hm," he murmurs. His eyes soften. "Yeah."
It's nice, having someone who simply has faith in you.
So when there is that split-second uncertainty in Kasumi's expression, and when she trails off about a senpai of hers, he looks at her with concern. "Everything going okay with your club?" he wonders. When they spoke a couple weeks ago, he'd been concerned about causing problems for her by hanging out with her.
Still, he doesn't want to bring down the mood, especially when she's competing in only a couple more days. "Sounds good to me," Ren says of an outing--even if he does think that Akechi asking a girl two years his junior to help him with the youth demographic is patently absurd. (Not in a bad way, at least.) "I don't mind helping out either," he adds. But more importantly-- "Where do you want to go?" he asks... ... ...Kasumi.
If this outing is supposed to be a pre-victory celebration, why wouldn't he ask her? (This is a genuine question, too. If Akechi is also friends with Kasumi, why should he be jealous, especially of an outing he himself suggested? ...Ren still underestimates just how two-faced Akechi can be.)
~ * ~
Whether it's Kasumi's own idea or one Akechi suggests and/or plants in her head, though, it isn't long before all three of them are in Kichijoji--specifically, at that cafe he'd met up with Akechi at not too long ago. In addition to coffee, they've got a delicious soda float--just the thing for cooling off in the July heat. Ren will have that for themself.
<Pose Tracker> Goro Akechi has posed.
Ren's 'good natured' tweaking, causes Akechi to smile his way, "Aha, well... lately it's because of the Phantom Thieves case. With Kaneshiro's confession, I'm being called in to interrogate his subordinates and so on and so forth."
Ren and Makoto have no idea how much covering for them Akechi has had to do in regards to the evidence to prevent anything getting back to Sae on their incident bursting into Kaneshiro's club. Fortunately, interrogations were selectively edited, Makoto's contact was erased from Kaneshiro's phone so that his lists of youth he was black mailing couldn't get back to the police.
Because indeed, Kaneshiro knew that the 'Student Council President' was Sae's sister, and he wanted to apologize to her directly. Fortunately he was quite 'amenable' to atonement by keeping his mouth shut.
Busy busy busy.
"Oh? Well when you ask me like that, how could I possibly refuse?" Akechi says, quick to accept her offer, "I'd enjoy taking you up on that." And indeed, he's happy enough to take the information too, if he offers it.
Yes, he definitely didn't mention names. It was simply a rumor of Yoshizawa being involved with a 'rough crowd' of which someone had a 'criminal record'. There's just enough plausible deniability there. Silly him - he didn't in fact know that it was Amamiya-kun.
"Now now, you shouldn't discount yourself. Few know what it's really like to work behind the scenes in mass media, so I'm certain from our conversations that you know far more than you realize." He says, praising her for her knowledge... of a side of her life, that Ren knows nothing about.
"Indeed so, at the time I was unaware it was about Amamiya-kun. Aha... I should have been more cautious, but I suppose that is the nature of rumors." He says with a 'oh silly me' sort of chuckle, "Ordinarily I'd look into it more than I did, but since it was an acquaintance, I decided to ask her directly." He says, explaining.
Kasumi explains her club environment, and Akechi shifts his stance, to place a hand to his chin, "Overly enthusiastic... could it be that you have a rival within your own club?" He asks instead of Ren's approach of asking if something is wrong. He hasn't settled on that, but it's the easiest way to ask for clarification. But then he drops his hand, and smiles back at her, "Why thank you, I would certainly appreciate consulting you on the matter."
Ren asks... Kasumi, well that's only polite, and he doesn't have a newspaper to crush.
-=-=-
Akechi has chosen his seat, with his briefcase at his side. Akechi too has taken a cup of coffee, "Oh? Yoshizawa-san... do you enjoy hot beverages in the summer?" He chats, small talk mostly. It's a question worth asking, though also perhaps a touch absurd, given that his own beverage is hot.
But he's waiting for Ren to point that out, or Kasumi to do so, because it will allow him to lead the conversation in a certain way.
<Pose Tracker> Kasumi Yoshizawa has posed.
"Ahahaha, yes, yes, it's fine." Kasumi waves off Ren's question about her club, "It's nothing unusual, just the normal competitiveness between club members. It happens." Especially those times when only one member from a club can be chosen as a representative. Of course some others might not take it especially well when they aren't chosen. This would also imply an affirmative to Akechi's own question about a rival. But surely Kasumi's assurances that things are fine are convincing!
When Ren asks where they should go--and asks Kasumi specifically--she raises a finger to her lip in thought, "Hmmm..." ... ... ... "... I suppose I am a little peckish?"
And thus the three end up at the cafe! In addition to coffee, Kasumi has a small plate with a creme caramel custard pudding in front of her. She takes a spoon to it and carves out a piece, putting it into her mouth. Her expression looks to be one of restrained joy as she holds back from squealing in delight at the rich dessert.
Akechi brings up the subjects of hot beverages and Kasumi tilts her head in thought, "Mmmm... I suppose I don't mind them." She does have a coffee in front of her after all into which she stirs some sugar. Kasumi slowly takes a sip. After putting the cup down again, she does goes on to say, "Though I suppose I find myself drinking cold drinks more often, to help cool down from exercise."
Kasumi then turns to Ren and smiles, "How about you, senpai? Do you drink a lot of coffee?" Looks like Kasumi didn't return the question back to Akechi as one might expect. Is she just trying to be polite and include Ren in the conversation?
<Pose Tracker> Ren Amamiya has posed.
They really don't have any idea. How could they? If Kaneshiro had a change of heart, then clearly he deleted those pictures he took of them and any other evidence that might connect them to him. If there were any evidence, surely Akechi wouldn't just cover it up. Ren has already realized that half his personality is a lie, but he does at least insist he really does believe in Justice, and that he doesn't trust in the Phantom Thieves's version of it.
"Oh yeah?" Ren says blandly, knowing nothing of this. Even so, it's plausible. "Must be intense work."
Sadly for Akechi, he isn't at all put out by him and Kasumi talking about her media background, or that he didn't know about it until now. Part of making friends with someone is getting to know them better over time, and besides, it's always fascinating to see what's so normal to a person that they don't see it as unusual or extraordinary to others at all. Ren listens with interest, and that's all.
He's not sure he trusts that Akechi really had no idea whatever rumors he'd heard were about him, but if Kasumi's a... an 'acquaintance,' not a 'friend,' he says--then it does make sense to get in touch with her about it first. "Sure," Ren says noncommittally either way.
Kasumi meanwhile assures them that things are fine and it's just normal competitiveness. This, too, makes sense to Ren, so while he's still concerned about that shadow that had cast its darkness on her face a moment ago, he's willing to let her leave it at that. "Having a rival can be fun. I hope it's like that for you too."
~ * ~
It's a little unusual to drink hot beverages in summer, but not that unusual. Leblanc still gets some regulars coming in, even though its fare is all hot. Ren smiles to watch Kasumi enjoy her pudding so thoroughly; it really is a joy to see her so utterly happy. There's something so honest about her... He could never imagine her being anything but what she is.
"A cup a day every morning," Ren tells Kasumi matter-of-fact. "Sometimes more." ...Given that he's got a soda now, maybe he should cut back on the caffeine... That aside, he gives Akechi and his own hot beverage a pointed look. "So what do you have, Akechi?"
<Pose Tracker> Goro Akechi has posed.
"It can be. Mafia can be particularly hard to crack given their codes of honor." He tells Ren, "But their boss confessing has done wonders in demoralizing them. They've all been quite ready to turn on him, in hopes of getting various plea deals."
In a sense, Ren may feel as if he had made Akechi's job easier with Kaneshiro and may get a sense of satisfaction in that regard, but it's quite the opposite...
"Aha... well, I'm certain given your diligence that you won't lose to her." Is his simple reply regarding competition between clubmates. He perhaps has strong opinions on what rivalries ought to be like, though he doesn't go into them.
A little peckish? Well that's fine by Akechi, it merely extends the 'celebration' if they're getting dessert. Akechi doesn't order any dessert for himself though. Which might be somewhat unusual to Kasumi, albeit not Ren after their recent experiences together. Doesn't he famously have a sweet tooth?
Kasumi's response is actually fairly expected, since she's rather guileless (at least in Akechi's eyes). That simple joy over her dessert is written all over her face. It's... a reaction he's never quite understood, in anyone.
"I see, when it comes to your training regimen, you make sure to cover all of your bases." He says, as if thoughtfully commenting on her lifestyle as an athlete. And right on cue, Ren notices, as Akechi chuckles, "Pointing out my coffee is just as hot are you? Well it's more for wakefulness, than preference in my case. It's been a long day, and both the bitterness and acidity help with keeping my focus sharp."
Akechi brings out his phone, and taps over a few images upon it, as if he's searching for something, "Speaking of which, the ad campaign I wanted to discuss..." Akechi brings up a digital photo, of the Calling Card sent by the Phantom Thieves to Kaneshiro. "... it's rather related to the Phantom Thieves of Hearts. Given that nearly every appearance I've had of late I get asked about them, it's necessary to consider their own 'branding' being in 'opposition' to my own so to speak."
He slides the phone closer so that Kasumi can look. "Amamiya-kun and I have spoken on the Phantom Thieves of Hearts rather extensively as of late, so I find myself interested in your own opinion on their actions."
He's definitely not looking at Ren at this moment, but he's definitely looking rather satisfied with himself.
<Pose Tracker> Kasumi Yoshizawa has posed.
"A rival, huh?" Kasumi seems a little deep in thought at the idea as she pokes at her cream pudding. She did used to have someone that one could consider a rival... And it did certainly make things more fun. Kasumi looks a little sad for a moment as she recalls those past feelings... But then she smiles, looking straight at Ren again and saying, "Perhaps! Not sure I'd say we're at that point yet. I haven't been with hte club very long, after all."
Kasumi listens along the two talk about some rather serious stuff. Akechi even makes mention of the Mafia at one point, which cause Kasumi's eyes to widen a little in surprise. Though really she should expect Akechi to be working on some potentially dangerous things while he consults for the authorities. Still, it seems so far outside her own world.
The conversation does briefly come around to Kasumi again as Akechi comments on her diligence, "Of course! It's important to train properly. Otherwise you might develop bad habits, or do things that adversely affect your health." Kasumi raises a finger, "For example, Akechi-san. You need to make sure to take proper breaks when working so you don't wear yourself out. Do that too much and it can cause serious problems with your health!" She smiles after her considerate lecture about his long day.
Finally they get to the main reason Akechi wished to talk about. As he proceeds to explain and show her the photo, Kasumi leans forward to take a look, "Ohhhh? The Phantom Thieves again? I guess that makes sense." The Calling Card is of course familiar, "Ah, yes, I've heard of these. I remember seeing the one that was plastered around school for Kamoshida-sensei too... Though this one is clearly a better quality."
Kasumi looks a little surprised again, "Oh? You two have been discussing them?" She glances between Akechi and Ren for a moment, before a mischievous smile grows on her face, "I seeee..." What exactly is she thinking?
Well, whatever it is, she doesn't let on as she continues, "Well, I don't know much about the Phantom Thieves beyond what the news has reported. But may I ask what you're trying to accomplish with this ad campaign?
<Pose Tracker> Ren Amamiya has posed.
It doesn't especially. Ren hadn't changed Kaneshiro's heart for Akechi's sake. However, it does give him some satisfaction knowing that for all Akechi bad-mouths the Phantom Thieves, he's still picking up where they left off.
"You could get it iced," Ren points out to Akechi. That's the point, moreso than him drinking coffee itself; it makes sense that he'd want to stay awake. The fact that Akechi doesn't order dessert isn't a surprise--not because Ren thinks he doesn't have a sweet tooth, but because he didn't really care for the desserts here before. (Because that had to have been it, that he just didn't like this place's desserts. Who would lie about liking sweets?)
He takes a sip of his soda, which is fairly sweet all on its own; his lips curve up slightly when Kasumi lectures Akechi on attending to his health better. She's plenty sweet herself... even if it feels like there's also some sorrow to her. "Give it time," he encourages her. She is a first year, and it has only been a few months so far.
Less sweet and more bitter is Akechi, who brings up a photo on his phone. When he sees what it is, however much that the phone is angled more towards Kasumi... his lips purse on his straw. He's definitely doing this on purpose--and yet... Akechi is so good at making things sound plausibly deniable that it's even making Ren question their run-in earlier today. How much of that was actually sincere, and how much was a con?
He's so goddamned annoying.
Though Kasumi's mischievous look does bring back some good humor. "What's that supposed to mean?" he prompts, smiling at her. (He doesn't comment on the increase of quality in the calling cards. It's just objectively true...)
His eyes slide back towards Akechi. What is he trying to accomplish with this ad campaign? He'd very much like to hear the answer to that too.
<Pose Tracker> Goro Akechi has posed.
Ah... Akechi can understand that look. Less a rival, more a bully, he suspects, given Yoshizawa's declining performance. "Well with any luck it will get to that point. The idea of a rival that pushes you to climb ever higher... it has it's own appeal, wouldn't you say?"
But he's also petty enough to poke that wound as if he hadn't noticed.
"I could, but that doesn't have the same appeal." He says to Ren with a smile, "A hot cup of coffee does wonders for wakefulness, in the way an iced doesn't. And besides, most iced coffees are served cloyingly sweet these days."
Kasumi then turns it back, to lecturing him upon his health. It reminds him of Umie doing the same recently, "You do have a point, but is this not a proper break right now?" Akechi says, with something of an impish smile at her, like he's already 'way ahead of her' or perhaps - merely being an opportunist, in the sense of using them all sitting down together to cover for them. "To be perfectly frank though, I don't particularly need much sleep to be at my best - and I rather enjoy being busy all the time."
It's not that he's rejecting she has a point, simply saying that he's special enough that it makes her point less of a problem for him than others. Look at him! Not even a hint of a dark circle under those eyes of his.
Ren is obviously annoyed and Akechi couldn't be prouder of it, yes, be annoyed - it means you're annoyed by him... but you're not yet walking off, now are you?
Kasumi's response, well it's definitely a little guarded at first in his opinion, as he smiles and chuckles, "Yes their first effort was rather amateurish... but they were starting out at the time. I believe they had someone with a certain 'artistic panache' join them while they were targeting Madarame." He just says that so plainly to Kasumi! It's almost like if one asks, he might just say who the artist is.
But Kasumi asks him what his objective is, "Mostly to make certain my image aligns properly with my TV appearances as being opposed to this new fad. As someone involved in the media, you have to stay rather on top of trends like this to retain the same 'clout' so to speak... wherein you'll continue to be invited back."
His opposition to the Phantoms can't SIMPLY be for the sake of his brand though! And he can't ONLY consider them a fad! That wouldn't make any sense given how vehemently he opposes Ren in their discussions of ideology. Yet Ren calls her on her mischievous look, and Akechi smiles, "Now you've got me curious as well."
<Pose Tracker> Kasumi Yoshizawa has posed.
Kasumi nods a little when Ren says to give it some time. She does seem to think about it quietly a little more as Akechi adds his own words. Though his thoughts on the matter might be going a little too far. At least with a word like 'bully'. Though perhaps during his investigations at Shujin, he might have occasionally heard students gossiping about Kasumi's true value on the gymnastics team and whether she's worthy of her honor student status. It might certainly imply the possibility of bullying going on.
But at the very least it's probably not too serious as Kasumi is able to easily smile again as the conversation continues on. She doesn't press too hard about Akechi's work habbits, after all it's not her place to do so beyond her concern for a friend. She nods along to him, saying, "Perhaps this could be a break, though you are also bringing up your work during it." She refers to the reason he suggested they talk.
Though when the two question her further about her mischievousness, she just smiles innocent, "Oh, nothing~" Quickly moving on!
Kasumi nods along in understanding as Akechi explains his position, and she then continues on to confirm her understanding, "And you want to create an ad campaign more focused towards people our age?" She crosses her arms, "That makes sense... A lot of kids at school seem to think they're like some kind of superhero team fighting for justice. Which is different from most discussions about them I hear at my father's work."
<Pose Tracker> Ren Amamiya has posed.
Ren is annoyed, not offended. When things are good with Akechi, they're very good--they have a lot of fun with him. Even right now, when it's not so good and he's just irritating, he's at least enjoying being around Kasumi.
He does furrow his eyebrows at him, though. "What level of sweet do you like?" he wonders. "You said that about the desserts here too. It's almost like you don't have a sweet tooth at all."
They are taking a break, of sorts... but they're also talking about work. "She's got a point," Ren chimes in with Kasumi. Arguably Akechi's working right now, given present company and the sharp uptick in Phantoms talk of late. But Akechi insists he does fine on little sleep and enjoys being busy. And that's why you show up at random over at Leblanc, Ren thinks with dry humor. He knows what Akechi's really there for, and it isn't the coffee.
Case in point: Akechi pointing out that The Phantoms must have gotten someone artistically inclined on the team just before changing Madarame's heart. Ren only sits, hands draped on their thighs, and lets the two of them talk. ...However much Kasumi doesn't seem to be interested in saying what's on her mind in regards to the two of them debating the Phantom Thieves.
They do frown at the way Akechi talks about The Phantoms vis-a-vis himself and his media appearances. The more he talks about it, the flatter their glare gets. It doesn't help that Kasumi approaches the topic like she has no strong opinions on it one way or another, the way she methodically describes how other people have been talking about them--something that actually rather stings.
But they don't interrupt, even so. Kasumi's got a right to her own opinion, and Akechi probably just wants to see them upset anyway.
<Pose Tracker> Goro Akechi has posed.
"... Well, mostly I eat sweets because it's an easy crowd-pleaser." He admits to Ren, as if engaging with their earlier cafe visit together by following up on the point, "Honestly, I'm not really partial to them at all. I try so many in my day to day because it's part of a marketing strategy. You'll notice that I always take my coffee black, for example."
Is there a single thing that he does that isn't fake? Well, Kasumi might not find it unusual, since her father works in 'the biz' after all.
It may seem like Kasumi's got him there, which even Ren acknowledges, with the simple point that he hasn't exactly stopped working, even on his break. "Well when your work is so fascinating, why would you ever want to unplug?" He says with a smile, and it's like he truly does enjoy it. He certainly does have boundless energy towards his work at least...
Kasumi's mischievousness though, has Akechi chuckle, "Careful... putting such a mystery right before a detective such as myself, may make it quite irresistible."
Ren falls silent though on the subject of the Phantom Thieves, which isn't unexpected, he has the pressure of having to be quite careful on the matter.
But...
Kasumi's own words, it causes him to nod that way, "Yes, precisely. I think it's necessary to set a certain 'tone' for the world we like to see. And I would say that I cannot agree with their methods." Though he does look at Kasumi for some time there, given her response, "And what of your own feelings, Yoshizawa-san?" Akechi asks more plainly, "If you're worried about an argument, then let me put your feelings at ease. I'd hardly be upset if you disagreed with my perspective."
Ordinarily he wouldn't bother pressing, but in Ren's company, well - it's self evident why he feels the need.
He even smiles broadly at that, "Just ask Amamiya-kun. I quite enjoy it, actually." And by doing so, he certainly hints at where Ren's own feelings lie, if Kasumi and Ren haven't spoken on the matter in the past.
Either way, he hopes to get some reaction out of her on the matter.
<Pose Tracker> Kasumi Yoshizawa has posed.
Kasumi continues to smile as Akechi points out the dangers of putting a mystery in front of a detective. It seems the combined interest from the two finally does get her to answer, "Oh, it's nothing. I was just thinking that it's good that you two seem to get along well!" It certainly seems that way with the two apparently discussing things often! And the way they lightly jab at each other.
But when asked about her own feelings on the matter of the Phantom Thieves, Kasumi crosses her arms and stares off into space in thought. She's silent for a little while before she starts, "I can certainly understand their desire for justice. Their targets so far have been very bad people... And there's no denying that the world is a better place with people like that behind bars."
Kasumi tilts her head to the side a little as she thinks some more, "Mmmmm... But I don't think they're going about it the right way. I don't know how they're doing it... Blackmail? Drugs? But the way their targets changed so quickly, it seems unnatural. People don't just suddenly change like that in a snap. It takes effort and time for people to work through their issues and change who they are. It seems like the Phantom Thieves are short-cutting that somehow... Like they're doing that work for the person. And so, as a result, one has to wonder if the resulting changes are actually a true change that the person has gone through."
Kasumi then smiles and rubs the back of her head, "I don't know if any of that makes sense, but it's just how a feel. Though it's kind of a difficult subject to think about... I guess that's why people like Maruki-sensei spend their lives studying psychology to figure these things out."
Kasumi then looks at Ren, eyes sparkling in interest as she asks, "What about you, senpai? What do you think?" Kasumi has a reasonable idea as to how Akechi sees the Phantom Thieves from all the interviews he's done. But she's never head Ren's perspective on them!
<Pose Tracker> Ren Amamiya has posed.
"You were, huh?" Ren says to Kasumi, smiling a bit. They glance at Akechi. They get along well, huh...? She's not wrong. Ren has yet to turn down one of Akechi's invitations to go out somewhere, and as annoying as he is, they do enjoy his company... most of the time. Well, maybe "enjoy" is a strong word. Maybe invigorating would be better. He keeps them on their toes.
Case in point: the confession about sweets. Ren blinks twice in Akechi in muted astonishment. "You--actually don't?" he utters. He had noticed that Akechi takes his coffee black, and that had been one of the many little confusing things about him that make Akechi so difficult to read. Knowing that he doesn't have any kind of sweet tooth at all, contrary to what he's said in his ads, is genuinely surprising. He knows there's a lot that Akechi hides or presents at an angle, so to speak, but seriously, who falsifies what kind of food they like?? "I feel lied to..." he mutters.
It's not even that Ren's invested in Akechi liking sweets. It really is just that baffling to them. Exactly how much of a "marketing strategy" does he need? How far into his personal life does he apply that? At least when they're in private, among friends, he'll admit otherwise, but... Why in the world does Akechi go that far? Isn't being a detective supposed to be about pursuing the truth, not "setting a tone"?
Ren shakes his head. Don't forget, but move on. "He's telling the truth about that one," he says dryly, folding his arms. "Akechi loves to argue."
Not just argue, but stir shit. In inviting Kasumi to air her thoughts on the Phantom Thieves, Ren gets to hear directly from a friend not in the know what she thinks of his Justice. It stings to hear her say that she thinks they're doing things the wrong way, and he can't even defend himself by saying she's got the wrong idea of how they do things. How could he even explain that to someone who doesn't know anything about the Metaverse? Maybe a change of heart is a shortcut--but the things Kamoshida, Madarame, and Kaneshiro were doing didn't, couldn't allow for them to repent normally. Left to their own devices, they'd never repent. It's because they wouldn't that The Phantoms have to steal their distorted desires!
...and of course, saying those things in their head and being unable to say them aloud must be Akechi's own dig. Ren gives him a flat look. Akechi can be really nasty when he wants to be. They breathe a soundless sigh.
Even nastier is how Kasumi has no clue that she's been put in the middle of their struggle. Her eyes sparkle like this is just a lively, theoretical debate that doesn't actually affect any of their lives directly. Ren looks at her with a pang in their heart. She's right about one thing; it is a difficult subject. Dr. Maruki probably wouldn't have a snack sweet or salty enough for a session about the matter. They rub the side of their head, then fold their arms and legs anew. She asked; they're not going to lie about how they feel.
"The Phantom Thieves are justice," they assert, "for everyone who's been saved by their actions."
...but they're not going to get into the weeds, either. She acknowledges that the world is better for the changes they've wrought; that'll just have to be enough.
<Pose Tracker> Goro Akechi has posed.
"Oh? Do you truly think so?" Akechi smiles at the idea that Ren and him get along since he knows the two of them can - and do fight quite often. He's a truly interesting individual. But 'enjoy' is accurate for Akechi, even if he has certain contradictory stabs of emotion there that gainsay that feeling.
Ren however seems utterly flabbergasted by the fact that he doesn't like sweets, "Oh? I thought you'd realized. Presenting oneself in a favorable light is really nothing surprising." Indeed, if you think about it, how strange would it seem for a boy his age to say he doesn't like sweets? Doesn't like food? Liking sweets is relatable. While he was annoyed before at Ren calling the way he lives fake, today he smiles and says, "More surprising is just how innocent you seem to be."
Yet, Kasumi begins speaking on her own feelings on the Phantom Thieves at his prompting (or yes, shit-stirring because indeed he loves to argue), and Akechi listens to her start, and he can understand that she's qualifying her true opinion with those caveats long before it comes, as if to try and show understanding for the 'Phan-dom'.
Before finally pulling the rug out from beneath them. Does Akechi enjoy that Ren can't say the truth aloud, even to him? Absolutely! But that's simply how Akechi lives, is it not? Forcing Ren to choose his words carefully in the same way, to play the game, thrust, parry - riposte - it's fun to him.
"So you believe that their confessions come not from a sincere desire to change themselves, but because the Phantom Thieves of Hearts have, forced the issue utilizing unknown methods." Akechi summarizes, as a form of active listening, "It's not a viewpoint that dissimilar from my own."
Maruki-sensei, Akechi doesn't reach for his notebook right now, but remembers it Shujin's new Counselor in the wake of Kamoshida...
It is a nasty strategy, to set Kasumi up against Ren, but he at least doesn't treat her as nasty for having that opinion, in fact he seems like he respects it. "As for myself - I believe the choices we make should always be our own." He says, as he follows up on it, to add a perhaps, stronger commitment, "And not made for us by someone else's convenience... even if it is truly for society's betterment."
Ren however does say that the Phantom Thieves are justice, and rather than voice opposition, which is rather obvious, he says to Kasumi, "Amamiya-kun remains steadfast in his support for the Phantom Thieves." And with an smugly affable smile adds, "I quite value his opinion on the matter as well, few are willing to voice an opinion with such resolve behind it."
A beat.
"But do the Phantom Thieves being 'Justice' for the victims in your eyes, necessitate that Yoshizawa-san is... wrong?"
He asks Ren, as if to see if he'll commit to her being wrong so softly, or soften his stance and say that her opinion could be valid?
Indeed, one could call the Phantoms 'Justice' and still say the concerns of the same sort she just voiced have validity.%
<Pose Tracker> Kasumi Yoshizawa has posed.
Discussing the morality of pretending to enjoy eating sweets for the purposes of creating a favourable image is all well and good...
... But it pales in comparison to actually just eating sweets. Which is why Kasumi is content to just take more spoonfuls of her cream pudding as Akechi and Ren argue the point. She smiles joyfully after each bite.
Kasumi certainly doesn't disagree with Ren's own thoughts on the Phantom Thieves, "It's true. Their actions have ultimately led to a good outcome."
Akechi meanwhile expresses a sentiment similar to her own, to which Kasumi points her spoon at him, "Exactly! Whether we change as people, should ultimately be up to us."
Then Akechi points out that Ren's views do not necessarily make her own incorrect. Kasumi nods along and so summarises, "It's the age old question of do the ends justify the means..." She takes the final bite from her pudding and then muses, "I'm not really sure myself... This is just a theoretical discussion we're having over coffee and snacks. In such an environment, it's easy to say that, from the egg of a serpent, comes a serpent... But I imagine things can look very different when actually directly facing the evil things that people like Kamoshida-sensei have done..." Kasumi looks clearly sad as she thinks of how that poor girl Shiho must have felt to do what she did... And how the justice brought about by the Phantom Thieves may have brought some relief to her.
<Pose Tracker> Ren Amamiya has posed.
The frustrating thing is that Ren had realized on some level; he just hadn't understood what the contradiction he'd noticed meant until Akechi said it more plainly. In retrospect, thinking back to their previous conversation on the matter, Akechi had said it plainly, Ren just hadn't understood. They think they're a pretty good read of people most of the time, but when they aren't, or when they don't understand all the way, they're really off the mark, it feels like...
So when Akechi smiles and calls him innocent, Ren feels a vein or three bulge in his forehead. That smarmy, condescending...!! How is he innocent because he didn't realize Akechi was lying about his basic tastes?! His hands clench under the table for a moment until he can calm down enough to relax them.
It helps that Kasumi is over there, simply and straightforwardly and actually enjoying the thing she chose, of her own volition, unforced by anyone else, to eat.
...So naturally Akechi tries to ruin that too. Ren responds this time with their stony poker face. Ultimately, Kasumi seems to be somewhere between the two of them; she acknowledges Ren's points as easily and as untroubled as she does Akechi's. Ren rubs a lock of their bangs. Right. Whatever game Akechi's trying to play here, Kasumi doesn't deserve any ire. She doesn't know, and she can't know, and that's a good thing. If she doesn't need to be saved by The Phantoms... that's a good thing.
"People's choices should be their own, sure," they say quietly to Akechi and Kasumi both. "But when a person's choices end up destroying other people's lives for their own convenience, and they make it clear they're going to keep making those choices, something needs to be done to stop them." They look at Kasumi. "Is a change of heart really worse than sending someone to jail, only for them to commit the same crimes after getting released?" They look at Akechi. "Or, alternately, sending them to jail to eventually get executed because they can't get released?"
Does that mean that Kasumi is wrong, though? Ren frowns, but in thought rather than irritation as they figure out how to respond. "Is a change of heart a 'shortcut' compared to someone realizing on their own what they're doing is wrong and deciding for themselves to change? I'll agree that it does look like it." He looks at Kasumi; seeing her sadness as she acknowledges how the victims must have suffered, his eyes soften. "If you think that's the wrong way to do things, I can get where you're coming from. I know how much you value hard work, and I respect that," he continues gently. "Personally, though, I can't value the time and energy it would take for horrible men like that to come around to how horrible they are on their own over the safety and wellbeing of the people they were actively victimizing every single day."
Especially when those men were poised to ruin their life, and the lives of their friends, if they hadn't done something to protect each other and other victims like them. But this is just a theoretical conversation over drinks, so that naturally gets no mention.
<Pose Tracker> Goro Akechi has posed.
To those who love sweets perhaps! Akechi however, only eats them, he has no love for them. Perhaps he even resents them, on some level... though one cannot imagine why, who would resent sweets for their existence?
Seeing Ren get so upset about being called innocent is rather adorable though. He'd swear he spiked his blood pressure and heart rate at least 20 points.
Akechi at least concedes the point Kasumi and Ren makes on the 'ends', with a nod of acquiescence. Indeed, Kamoshida, Madarame, Kaneshiro - and others they've targeted in Mementos, they belong in prison. He would never deny that, nor that it is better for some of their victims that they are.
But Akechi understands too that feelings are complicated, even for victims. Would every victim truly thank the Phantom Thieves of Hearts for what they've done for them? He doesn't think so. He has to actually close his eyes for a moment at Kasumi's comment from the 'egg of a serpent, comes a serpent'. It's not dissimilar from 'shitty parents give rise to shitty children'
And indeed, Ren hits upon that point directly, Akechi however waits, letting Ren not just finish that when it comes to not just his point, but answering whether Kasumi is wrong.
"You raise an interesting point... and I would posit that given the psychological profiles of Kamoshida, Madarame, and Kaneshiro that you're in fact correct. That it would take indescribable effort to change the people who they were before they became targets of the Phantom Thieves... if if it were possible at all." It's at least clear that Akechi thinks that it isn't possible to change these people ordinarily, that they simply are who they are... some perhaps as an accident of birth, but all still as the sum total of their choices.
"So, you tell me. If I were a victim and I felt I was being apologized to only because they were made to do so, would that apology hold any weight?" he says as he crosses his arms and settles back. "And if the perpetrator of such horrible crimes upon me were the type of person to feel no regret for what they did, then is the responsibility they take after their heart is forcibly changed not 'fake'?"
He's actually not being argumentative merely to be argumentative right now, "In my own experiences, there are many victims who would not find this to be not a kindness... but a cruelty to them. If the perpetrator of the crimes against them is incapable of feeling regrets for what they did to them under normal circumstances, then they should hate the circumstances of their just punishment with the whole of their being."
It is a mindset that may be a little alien, to Ren. Since it's not about doing acting to the maximum benefit - and deterrence in the future. But about the spite, and ill feelings a victim might have towards the criminal in question.
"And if forced to take responsibility, that becomes a kindness to them... at the expense of the feelings of their victims who would desire otherwise, because they believe it is exactly where they belong."
And strangely, as Ren looks at Akechi's expression, there's no faux affable smile, there's no smug, smirking, self-righteous personality. No, this somehow sounds... far more genuine than his normal, even than in their prior conversations. He's putting this forward to Ren, and trying to figure out what he thinks about it, like he's truly interested.
<Pose Tracker> Kasumi Yoshizawa has posed.
Kasumi nods along in understanding as Akechi points out the effort required for such criminals to change so much without unusual means. She puts her hand up beneath her chin and leans against the table, turning to stare off into nothing as she continues listen while quietly musing, "Such a drastic change... It must be difficult to become such a completely different person..."
As Kasumi continues to listen, both Ren and Akechi are making good points. It's starting to feel like they're going way beyond her league. She can't help but agree with many of the things they say, even if some of them contradict each other.
'Wow, these two are smart.'
But, as Kasumi continues to rest her head in her hand, glancing between the two and listening to their heated debate, she can't help but start to smile with that same mischievous, knowing smile from earlier.
<Pose Tracker> Ren Amamiya has posed.
It's not like Ren doesn't enjoy irritating Akechi back, so maybe turnabout is fair play... But their blood pressure and heartrate definitely shot up by a lot.
Ren at least doesn't believe in children being inevitable mirrors of their parents, at least. Influence is inevitable, whether social or biological, but an individual is exactly that: an individual. They'll grow into themselves whether anyone likes it or not, including themselves. But they don't see this conversation as being about that. If anything gives them pause about the topic, it's Kasumi musing about how difficult it must be to change so drastically so quickly. That's a perspective Ren honestly hasn't considered before, and it does give them food for thought.
Neither Kamoshida nor Madarame knew what was going on in their Palaces. Kaneshiro might have, but they can't know that for sure. To all of them, their distortions suddenly cleared up out of nowhere and they could finally see the enormity of what they'd done. Ren has to admit: that would be really difficult to deal with. That isn't a reason to stop or recant, of course, and Ren's sympathy is extremely limited; it's just something to think about.
That could be an opening for Akechi to pounce on. When he instead admits they're right on at least one point, Ren stares at him. It doesn't feel like a gotcha or a gimme...
...and it still doesn't feel like that, even when Akechi moves into his own point. That air of smugness isn't there. He sounds like... this is personal to him.
Like how Ren's stance is personal to them.
Is that just another deception, though? Another way of controlling the "tone" of the argument? ...Ren doesn't know. But this, at least, they can feel like is an engagement in good faith--and one that actually resonates closer to Ren than Akechi might think.
After all, when The Phantoms changed Kamoshida's heart, they were all victims of his--even Morgana had been locked up in that awful castle dungeon until Ren and Ryuji freed him. Changing his heart was the four of them taking direct action against him and claiming their own form of revenge. Up until the very end, they didn't even know for sure if the change of heart would work or if Kamoshida might end up dead as a result. Ultimately, it was Ann's choice to spare him, and not out of mercy--but to force him to live and face what he'd done.
If someone randomly changed and apologized out of the blue, yeah. It would seem fake. But it wasn't to the four of them, because they were the ones who made it happen.
The same goes for Madarame, who they only found out about because a victim of his--who had become a victimizer of someone else--complained that he was getting away with abusing others. Ultimately, Yusuke got to choose his form of revenge against him, too. And Makoto--she took responsibility for the students who'd been victimized by him by becoming a victim herself, and then chose to believe in The Phantoms' way of doing things and commit to a change of heart. They both got to redress the wrongs they'd suffered directly. And while those Mementos Shadows whose hearts they've changed may not have been anyone who wronged any of them directly, they were the result of requests from those who were. In a lot of ways, The Phantoms are exactly about what Akechi is talking about.
Not that Ren can admit to any of that. But they can acknowledge it in their heart--and by replying, "When you put it like that, I can see how a victim might hate seeing a change of heart in their abuser. It's only natural to hate someone who's hurt you and want to hurt them back. Not everyone can be so noble as to rise above that and move past it. Even if they did, I'm sure they'd be struggling with what happened to them for a long while afterwards. And..." The man who ruined Ren's life... they don't know his name. They don't really remember his face. He'll probably go on being a shitty human being for life while Ren suffers because of him. If he just showed up one day and apologized to Ren apropos of nothing, how would they feel about that? ...
"...Not everyone gets to carry out their own personal revenge against those who've wronged them," Ren says, voice low as they bow their head. The light off the lenses of their glasses shade their eyes from view for a second--until they raise their chin, eyes steely. "But if my options were 'never take revenge myself' or 'let them keep being horrible for life,' then I'd take the first option, every time. However I felt about it, it's more important to stop people like that before they do more harm." They sit up a little straighter. "Not to mention, The Phantoms' targets so far victimized a lot of people. Not all of them had the same experience or the same feelings about it. Maybe some of their victims are like you say and hate seeing their changes of heart, and wish they could've been jailed and humiliated or whatever, but there have definitely been other victims who feel saved because of those changes of hearts, too.
"You've seen the Phantom Aficionado Website, right?" The 'right' is barely necessary. The two of them have never discussed it before, but Ren would be very surprised if Akechi hasn't at least heard of it. "Posters there make requests for changes of heart all the time. Some of them even get their requests granted--or at least, we can assume they do, since they post again later talking about the change and thanking the Phantom Thieves for it. Should that poster have their pleas for help get ignored because there might be a different victim, suffering because of the same scumbag, who wants to make them suffer back?"
...
They're totally paying more attention to Akechi now...
...Good thing Kasumi doesn't seem to mind.
<Pose Tracker> Goro Akechi has posed.
It really is difficult for someone to become a completely different person, isn't it Yoshizawa-san?
Not that Akechi would know anything about that, in the same respect. Nor does he think all of his effort to change himself... actually did.
If it did, then the feelings he holds within himself would change too, wouldn't they? No, indeed, he believes he truly is - if not a mirror to Shido, then still became who he was. The 'Dark Son', with a poisoned lineage coursing through his veins.
Akechi is watching Ren quite intently, his attention now fully upon him, as he works through the problem he gave him. Questions which will define if they truly remain thesis and antithesis - or not.
Ren begins, and Akechi seems far too still, listening to his answer. He has to give him credit, it's a thoughtful answer, and it is his answer. Which is why on the opposite side of himself, facing Kasumi more than Ren, do his ungloved fingers dig a touch further into the opposite side of his arm than is comfortable.
The cafe around him, becomes white noise, as he listens to a mindset so alien to his way of life. He understands it, he simply rejects it, so - very, thoroughly.
The idea that one of Shido's other victims might simply put in a request, and that his years of pursuing his own justice, that his revenge could be spoiled by someone Shido missed in his purges - a woman that slipped through the cracks, putting in an entry on a website... or Ren himself, figuring out his identity, if he hasn't already.
It's fine It's fine It's fine It's fineitsfineitsfineitsfineHatehatehatehatehatehatehatehateKILL YOU FIRST
"I see." Akechi forces out, through his teeth, and just like that, the mask is back up, expertly, his grip is relaxed. That side of himself placed firmly behind a wall before he'd lunge across this table and ruin years of hard work on a simple impulse.
"I have heard of it..." He admits, in the aftermath, "... I do have to stay on top of trends after all. Your perspective then is that the greater good, is worth sacrificing someone's personal feelings and justice for... if another victim in immediate harm's way felt differently." He echoes it back, and while that is perhaps a reductive way of putting it, it's not exactly inaccurate phrasing either.
"I can't say that I agree with that, and it again comes down to choice, but I do appreciate you engaging with my points sincerely... our conversations on the subject are always quite interesting. However..." He looks sideways at Kasumi, "... I didn't mean to start an argument here. I suppose I just can't help myself sometimes. Since, we're supposed to be celebrating Yoshizawa-san's upcoming victory, perhaps we should change the subject to something lighter?"
LIKE HE DIDN'T CHANGE THE ARGUMENT IN THE FIRST PLACE?
But no, he had to do this in this case. He has exactly what he wants here. A rival, who rejects the fundamental core of his existence. Thesis... and Antithesis. He should be satisfied, MORE than satisfied, but no... in this moment, he finds he hates his Antithesis.
And if he doesn't get away from this, he might end up doing something he regrets.
Perhaps it's time my 'Other Self' pay him a visit after all.
Thoughts to ruminate over later, when he's much calmer.
<Pose Tracker> Kasumi Yoshizawa has posed.
Kasumi is starting to go a bit cross-eyed as the discussion between Ren and Akechi goes deeper and deeper. Many good points flowing between the two, she's finding it hard to disagree with any of them. This is clearly evidence that they've put a lot of thought into this already, hence the discussions that Akechi alluded to earlier. She's just a poor bystander who got thrown in at a moment's notice!!!!
Still, Kasumi does try to keep up, though remains quiet for the most part. Though that's just because she's focusing on trying to assimilate it all. Though as the discussion leads towards topic of revenge on behalf of the victims, Kasumi wonders, "Is it revenge, or justice that the Phantom Thieves are after?"
However, it's Ren bringing up the Phan-site that really causes Kasumi to perk up, "Wait! Their site takes requests for change of hearts!? Isn't that... Incredibly dangerous? How do the Phantom Thieves verify the requests? How do they choose who to target? Do those receiving a change of heart get asked if that's what they want? Are they able to defend themselves as is their right?"
Kasumi actually frowns a little, "The point of a justice system isn't just to punish the guilty, it's to prevent the innocent from being punished accidentally. And justice systems are massive and incredibly complicated for good reason! Surely the Phantom Thieves don't have that kind of process backing them?"
But then Akechi apologises--though perhaps not in so many words--for partially derailing their purpose for coming here. So Kasumi quickly raises her hands to shake it off, "No, it's okay. It's been an interesting discussion, if a little heated, ehehehe." She laughs a little sheepishly, "But maybe a change of subject is a good idea..."
...
...
What do they talk about now after that!?
<Pose Tracker> Ren Amamiya has posed.
Do the Phantom Thieves seek revenge or justice?
Justice, of course, Ren thinks immediately. But that, too, is something they can't say aloud.
Kasumi raises a lot of good points... or she would if Ren didn't know exactly how all those things are handled and that The Phantoms take a lot of care to avoid targeting innocent people. They thus give her a rueful smile. "Well, people post them. The Phan-Site's exactly what it says, a 'fan site.' It's run by a fan of the Phantoms, and other fans sometimes make posts, but the Phantom Thieves don't ever reply. That's why I said 'we can assume so.' It could be possible it's all a coincidence."
They can only rub the back of their neck at some of her concerns, though. Does a bank robber get asked if they consent to being arrested? Maybe she'd be less worried if she knew they did indeed get to fight to defend themselves first...
Akechi's concerns, meanwhile...
...feel a little off. Ren furrows their eyebrows at his intent regard, his tense frame, and how he summarizes their point. How there's an edge to his teeth for just a split-second before he's back to being pleasant boy-next-door Akechi. "That's not quite how I thought of it... but I guess you're not wrong," they reply, frowning.
Why do they feel so uneasy all of a sudden...?
Still-- "It was a good conversation. You both gave me a lot to think about," Ren admits, relaxing in kind. They smile at Kasumi's sheepish little laugh and add, "We can change the topic, though." Even if Akechi was in fact the one who brought it up in the first place.
Ren will need to end up leaving before too long anyway when Tsubasa Seki calls to let them know they're coming into Tokyo and they need them to look after their dog for the rest of the afternoon, but for right now, the three of them can celebrate Kasumi's upcoming success.